Episode 1

Double cancer didn't cause depression. Giving birth did: LIZ WISE

Published on: 20th December, 2021

Specialist Postnatal Depression Counsellor Liz Wise talks about her own personal experience of PND, which she suffered from with the birth of both her daughters. Despite surviving cancer twice, losing both her parents, losing two of her best friends and going through a very stressful divorce, none of these events ever gave Liz depression. Yet having her daughters did.  

We also speak to Liz’s daughter Emma. Whilst Liz’s mental illness caused bonding issues with Emma as a baby, this did not affect their relationship growing up. In fact, Emma says she feels Liz’s experience of PND made her an even better mum.

Liz made a full recovery. Since then she has been supporting mothers with postnatal depression for over twenty five years. She sits on the committee for The Association for Postnatal Illness and has her own charity The Cedar House Support Group which offers help to mothers through support groups in London and Surrey. Liz offers confidential one to one counselling either face to face, phone, online or email and runs PND support groups in London and Surrey.   (LINK IN SUPPORT BELOW)


In this episode we discuss:

[00:00] Introduction to Liz Wise – the queen of PND!

[01:49] Liz's traumatic molar pregnancy which developed into cancer (choriocarcinoma)

[02:46] The joy of finding she was pregnant with Emma

[04:11] Feeling disconnected from her baby

[05:04] Anxiety, her struggle with breastfeeding and wanting to withdraw from friends

[06:05] Liz's first panic attack whilst out shopping

[06:25] Getting support

[08:37] Over-compensating for her lack of feelings for Emma

[09:48] How it felt to be diagnosed with PND

[10:27] Suicidal feelings, referral to a psychiatrist and support from family

[14:12] Approaching having a second child

[15:42] Bonding with her new baby

[16:02] Coming down with PND for a second time - developing health anxiety

[20:06] Why Liz is grateful for experiencing PND - advice for other mums

[22:07] Liz's daughter Emma's experience of growing up with a mum affected by PND

[25:14] How Emma learnt about her mum’s PND

[27:24] Emma’s work as a virologist & work in SARS-CoV-2

[28:16] Normalising the conversation around mental health issues

[29:33] Emma speaks positively about the benefits of having a mum with PND

[33:31] A message to other parents - you’re not alone, you're not going to mess up your children


 *** TRIGGER WARNING: These are real-life conversations, from the heart, so please listen with discretion. Please also refer to our SUPPORT section below ***


KEY TAKEAWAYS:

  • You are not alone and will not feel this way for ever
  • Bonding issues won’t affect your relationship with your child later on
  • Talking about your feelings can normalise mental health issues
  • Support is available (please see SUPPORT links below)
  • Having PND can have a positive affect on your child

 

If you enjoyed this episode, please share, rate and subscribe. It really does make the difference in helping others find it – which means helping more parents in need.


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Email: bluemumdays@gmail.com


NEXT WEEK’S EPISODE:

In Episode 2 of Blue MumDays, I’ll be talking to Emily Goldhill about what it was like to have her baby during the height of the Covid pandemic in 2020, and how this contributed to her postnatal depression.


SUPPORT:

If you are struggling right now, please know that it’s okay to talk and reach out for help. YOU ARE NOT ALONE AND WILL NOT FEEL THIS WAY FOR EVER. We hope these support services are helpful (please note we do not check or monitor them individually).

 

Action on Postpartum Psychosis (APP)

Moderated Forum, click here to find out more.

Email: app@app-network.org

Tel: 020 3322 9900

 

Association of Postnatal Illness

Helpline: 10am – 2pm – 0207 386 0868

Email: info@apni.org

Live chat online facility

 

Best Beginnings

Free NHS-accredited Baby Buddy app offering evidence-based information and self-care tools to help parents during pregnancy and early stages of parenting.

App users also have access to a confidential, text-based Crisis Messenger which provides 24/7 support for new and expectant parents who are feeling extremely anxious or overwhelmed.

Birth Trauma Association

Email: support@birthtraumaassociation.org.uk

CALM

Contact CALM on their national helpline: 0800 58 58 58 (5pm-midnight)

 

Cedar House Support Group

Email: lwise@talktalk.net (Liz Wise)

Mobile: 07773 283556

 

Make Birth Better (Birth Trauma Support)

Email: hello@makebirthbetter.org

 

Maternal OCD

Peer support available, email info@maternalocd.org to arrange

 

Muslim Women’s Network

Helpine: 0800 999 5786, open Mon-Fri 10am – 4pm with support offered in English, Urdu, Punjabi, Mirpuri, Putwari, Hindko, and Bengali.

Email: info@mwnhelpline.co.uk

Online chat: www.mwnhelpline.co.uk

Text: 07415 206 936

 

Netmums

Netmums offer peer support via their Maternal Mental Health Drop-In Clinic.

 

NHS

Contact your local GP surgery.

Call the NHS on 111 or contact a local NHS urgent mental health helpline

If you are in crisis, visit Accident & Emergency at your nearest hospital.

 

PANDAS

Helpline open from 9am-8pm every day – 0843 2898 401

Email support available – info@pandasfoundation.org.uk

Petals

Petals offers free-of-charge specialist counselling to anyone who has experienced pregnancy or baby loss.

Web: petalscharity.org/counsellingcontact/

Email: counselling@petalscharity.org

Tel: 0300 688 0068

Samaritans

Tel: 116 123 (this is a free telephone number and will not appear on the phone bill)

Web: www.samaritans.org

Email: jo@samaritans.org

 

Shout

Text SHOUT to 85258 to start a confidential conversation with a trained Shout volunteer.

 

Twins Trust

Twinline is Twins Trust’s listening service for parents of twins, triplets and more. All the calls are answered by volunteers who have multiples themselves.

Twinline is open Monday to Friday 10am to 1pm and from 7pm to 10pm. 0800 138 0509, alternatively email asktwinline@twinstrust.org.

Web: twinstrust.org/let-us-help/support/twinline.html

 

Tommy’s

Tommy’s has a team of in-house midwives who offer free support and information for women and their families at any stage of pregnancy and after the birth.

Web: www.tommys.org

Helpline: Tommy’s helpline has been closed temporarily but their midwives are answering questions via email, Facebook, Instagram and Twitter.

Email: midwife@tommys.org

 

MUSIC by Joseph McDade

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About the Podcast

BLUE MUMDAYS
The Parental Mental Health Podcast
Blue MumDays is a podcast about perinatal illness, parenting and being kind to yourself. Up to 1 in 5 mums and 1 in 10 dads will suffer with their mental health after the birth of their baby. Having once interviewed the likes of Sir David Attenborough and Hans Zimmer during my BBC career, I’m now speaking to mums, dads and mental health experts each week, in an effort to understand my own experience of postnatal depression. Dispelling myths, smashing stigma & bringing hope to parents having a hard time.

About your host

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Vikki Stephenson

Vikki Stephenson is a Senior Creative, Consultant and Speaker with 20 years’ experience making award-winning campaigns for the BBC’s highest profile brands: Planet Earth II, Panorama, CBeebies, EastEnders, Dracula. Her work has been recognised internationally, winning 35+ industry awards - most since becoming a mum and working part-time.

In 2012 Vikki gave birth to her much-wanted son Stanley. Whilst she loved him dearly, she suffered a traumatic birth and felt overwhelmed and ill-equipped with the responsibility of bringing a human being into the world. She very quickly developed PND and anxiety, which left her with feelings of total failure. She worried that she didn't have the right answers, instincts or knowledge to be 'good enough' as Stanley's mum. The first year of Stan's life was sadly the hardest of Vikki's and she endlessly compared herself to others who seemed to find motherhood easy. However, through the support of the Cedar House Charity and long-term anti-depressants, Vikki slowly recovered.

11 years on, she is now a passionate advocate of perinatal mental health and is on a mission to help parents feel less alone, through her podcast series ‘Blue MumDays’. Its purpose is to help other mums and dads better understand their illness and give them the hope that they will make a full recovery. It gives a voice to the lived experience of real sufferers who have reached the other side, and - through interviews with experts – will signpost mums, dads, their partners and friends to help and support that may be hard to find.